Tales of the Rampant Coyote
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Tuesday, April 29, 2008
 
Drama vs. Fun?
It's kinda funny - when my job makes me work all through the night until nearly sunrise, I get very annoyed. But when I do it to myself - meh, it's just what has to be done. But after this weekend, I hope you can understand if I'm a little on the snarky side. I think I'm averaging four hours of sleep a night, which is pretty low even for ME.

Gareth Fouche, creator of the indie RPG Scars of War, posted recently about trying something similar to Frayed Knights' "drama star" system. The reaction was almost universally negative. Even when the system is presented entirely as a "bonus" on top of the regular saved-game system, it's seen as a detriment.

How dare you even consider NOT saving my entire game state! Well, except the bad stuff. I don't care about you forgetting about that.

And it goes back to the whole story versus gameplay thing. Again. A perfectly well-played game makes for a horribly boring story. Who would like hearing about the hero who always wins, always makes the best decisions, never falls for a trick, has no flaws, and rarely even suffers a setback (and then it's always because of things beyond his control)? A guy who is a lantern-jawed, cool hero who - when the chips are down - becomes a lantern-jawed, cool hero. The home basketball team that suffers win after win, until a caring coach figures out how to bring out their best and teach them about teamwork, so they can start... winning some more.

BOR-ING!


That makes for lousy stories. Yet when we play a game, we're out to win. That desire to win makes us unwilling to accept the intermediate defeats and the ups-and-downs that make a good story. So designers force them down our throats with non-interactive cut-scenes, making it clear to us that no, this twist of events that makes things more interesting is NOT in our control, so it's "safe" to accept it and move on....

Now, in practice --- at least so far, and for the imminent-release of the pilot for Frayed Knights, I can't say that my attempt to recruit the player to the storyteller side of things with the Drama Star system has been an unqualified success. I think it has a subtle effect on the game in that direction, which is good enough for me. It's been a pretty divisive topic in theory, yet in practice I don't know if the testers (hey guys, feel free to speak up to confirm or contradict this...) actually found it to be that big of a deal in either direction. I know the system still needs some tweaking, and it will undoubtedly play a much bigger deal in the full release than in the pilot (in practice, currently, you are likely to face the "boss" encounter with only barely three bronze stars - enough to rescue ONE character from incapacitation, but they will have only one hit point left and be likely to drop in the very next round unless the battle is nearly over...)

Maybe I am wimping out and I need to make the drama stars an even greater influence on the game. But as a gamer who tends to devote only "casual" time levels to playing games these days, I really don't want to use golden handcuffs on players to lock them to the game, or to give players with only 20 or 30 minutes to devote to a game per session a crippling limitation.

I remember - as Gareth points out - how frustrating it got in Diablo II trying to find that stupid portal before I quit for the day. It wasn't like you really lost any significant progress by quitting without finding the thing... all the experience points and treasure you gained was yours to keep, even if you ended up repeating a level or two. In fact, from a purely mechanical perspective, it was really a non-issue. But it exerted a powerful force on players... maddeningly frustrating on one level, but also introducing a level of tension that probably improved the game overall on another level.

But here's the big question: It's really about fun, not drama. Dramatic tension can definitely increase the fun... But there is also a point (well, a fuzzy-gray area) where story interferes with the fun. Where playing-the-game - to win - is far more enjoyable then putting up with all those dramatic peaks and valleys. Where do you draw the line?

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Comments:
This almost belongs in the Beta Forum for Frayed Knights but...

Well the only use of the drama stars so far has been restoring incapacitated people, and I don't think I've had enough to do that since the first version where their was a bug that gave me full drama points. And actually though, it feels more like I'm being penalized by the Drama Star System in Frayed Knights because while other games would allow me to resuscitate fallen party members after combats Frayed Knights doesn't. Since the drama stars are the only way to rez party members in a dungeon it's a waste to use them on anything else.

I think it would be much better if I could rez party members between combats with spells and allow drama stars to rez them to full health during combats.

Overall though, it's really too early to say with the amount of content in Frayed Knights.
 
So I take it you've not been using the potions of recapacitation?
 
I'm sorry to say this (I try to be positive when commenting on someone's monumental efforts), but the drama system did get on my nerves a bit. Only because I am a game hoarder, and I did feel compelled to keep playing to save the stars, even long after I really wanted a break. You really can't please everyone. Perhaps you could add "save plats" to the game, places to stand and save, where restoring there would keep the drama points, so OCD freaks like me could walk away for a while.
-Kris
 
Oh, PLEASE use golden handcuffs on me. Do you know how much I could sell those things for once I get out of them?

Score, baby.
 
...potions of recapacitation...what potions of recapacitation...hmm...loads up the game....oh, those potions of recapacitation. No, definitely have not been using those. Wonder how long those have been in the game. Never really pay attention to what the characters have equipped/readied, always looking in the party inventory instead. Odd that they're not usable from the party inventory.
 
I think the recap potions went in for Beta 1. Also, be sure to play with Chloe's new wand (which went in at the same time). Loads of fun. ;)

You have a point about not being able to use items from party inventory outside of combat, though. You should submit that in the testing forum.
 
Hmmm... that comes down to a design issue... the party inventory isn't accessible in combat, period. And it's really not intended that you be able to bring someone back in mid-combat easily. Prevention (buffs, etc) should be a better solution.

The potions are just provided in the pilot because of the unusual circumstances of the introductory quest. I kinda lock you in until you are done, rather than giving you the freedom to do as you will under normal circumstances... so the potions are there to cover for the other sins against Game Design I am committing.
 
Now, I haven't actually played the beta, so I don't really know the details of the system. But the thing that bothers me the most about the idea of session-based Drama Stars is how long they take to accumulate.

A lot of gamers (myself included a lot of the time) simply can't play a game for a long stretch of time. Maybe we've only got half an hour or so. If you can't accumulate enough points in that time to do anything useful, and you can't build them up over multiple sessions, then they become completely useless. (And if you *can* build them up in that amount of time, then they probably become too powerful for the people who do play long sessions.)

So in practice you end up penalising the people who can't play the game for long stretches of time, which doesn't seem like a good idea.
 
I think I suggested at some point having a special "pause" kind of save that could only be reloaded from once, but you'd get your drama stars back if you do.

Part of the problem is that there's frequently just no viable alternative to doing consistently well. Attempt to disarm a trap and get decapacitated? There's not much upside to that. Even if I got a full drama star, I'd probably just spend it bringing him back.

On the other hand, if the game rewards me for carrying on under difficult circumstances, I might give it a try. The reward could be extra drama stars, decreased chances of fizzling, more experience, or a cheezy little picture of a trophy that comes up when I finish the level.

The other big thing is to make failure not such a problem. If losing a battle means the end of the game, then of course I'm going to reload if I lose or am likely to lose. I'm reminded of Kingdom of Loathing here -- it's easy to lose a battle and get beat up, but you just live with it (partly because there's no other option).
 
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